How do we distinguish between reality and falsehood in an AI world?

In a world where AI image generators can generate lifelike images of events that never happened, how can we ever again trust visual evidence of anything? How can we ever have confidence that anything ever really happened, even the most basic of events and historical facts? Absolutely everything will become suspect because AI will now be able to fabricate images that look identical to real-world photographs

>b-b-but they aren't that good yet, you can still notice the flaws which give away that its fake

Sure. But one day this won't be the case. 2 years ago AI could only generate gloopy, weird-looking meme images. Now it can generate stuff that's basically IRL quality, with some flaws. In a few years time AI image generators will almost certainly be able to generate images totally indistinguishable from real world photographs. One day they will be able to generate 100% realistic video footage as well.

How on Earth is humanity going to deal with this new emerging world where it becomes impossible to discern between reality and falsehood? For one thing, it now becomes impossible to record news and history. Even if you have photo/video evidence of something happening, you can't trust it cause it could just be AI generated.

But it will also affect our personal lives. Imagine somebody uses AI to generate a video of you committing some horrible crime, and it's 100% realistic and features an identical copy of your real life voice. How could you ever convince everybody that it isn't real?

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  1. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Easy. Make an AI that can detect real images and fake images.

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      But how would this be possible once AI image/video generators are able to generate content which is 100% totally identical in quality to real world photo/video?

      Sure, right now you could probably detect small flaws and artifacts in AI-generated images which give away that it is AI. But pretty soon, this won't be the case. Eventually there will be nothing that gives away an image/video being AI generated. The real and the fake will look completely identical.

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        How I wish pic related was real. Imagine the pope having drip this sick.

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        >But how would this be possible once AI image/video generators are able to generate content which is 100% totally identical in quality to real world photo/video?
        How do we deal with a world where powerful entities can hire actors and VFX artists?

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          believe it or not, social media is not a substitute for the field of professional journalism

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        >once AI image/video generators are able to generate content which is 100% totally identical in quality to real world photo/video?
        Big assumption with no justification, statistical models are still just that.

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      “Once men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free. But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.”
      ― Frank Herbert, Dune

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        Truly prescient. There will be a butlerian jihaf in our lifetime.

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      this is how GANs are trained in the first place, moron

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        Cope and seethe moron.

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      >he doesn't know

  2. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Just assume that everthing you hear/see is fake and gay.

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      who cares if something actually happened or not

      But imagine how fricked a world we would live in if you literally cannot trust ANY photographic or video evidence of anything. It will be impossible to record evidence for anything anymore. Everything could potentially be fabricated. Even the most mundane things, like a photograph of your grandfather holding you as a baby, could be an AI generated fake.

      I don't think you understand how damaging this would be to humanity. It will drive us all insane. We will eventually end up at a point where everybody just has to assume that 100% of recorded history is fake because we will no longer be able to trust any evidence that we have of it. Even extremely well-documented events like World War 2 will become suspect in the eyes of future generations. All historical footage will suddenly become worthless. All of history will be reduced to the status of mere fairy tales and fantasy.

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        I don't really see how that's much different from the bullshit we've been reading on the web for the last 3 decades. At the end of the day, what it comes down to what sources you trust and your own judgment. Instead of someone saying something online it's now a picture of something online. Fake news has been a thing before this recent AI fad. And probably the most important thing is - people have believed and will continue to believe whatever the hell they choose to believe. Facts, by and large, DO NOT matter.

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          >I don't really see how that's much different from the bullshit we've been reading on the web for the last 3 decades.

          That is our intent, anon. We are destroying the poison by flooding the system. Soon, you will have to see it to believe it. It's the only way forward for mankind. The infinite support group of the internet has been a cancer on humankind. This is the chemo.

          >The infinite support group of the internet has been a cancer on humankind. This is the chemo.

          You don't.
          I've been talking about this for ages.

          It's gonna create a some weird society where we will be physical again, a renaissance of the physical world, you will have to see something to believe it like before television

          >It's gonna create a some weird society where we will be physical again, a renaissance of the physical world
          You all seem to think that this will only affect the internet, but you're not understanding just how far-reaching the consequences of this shit will be.

          Let's say in the future you want to read about history. You want to find out about WW1 or WW2 for instance. You're looking at videos of war footage, propaganda videos, speeches of war leaders, etc. Basic stuff just to get a general idea of what happened during the wars. But now, you cannot trust any of it. Every second of that footage and every pixel of every photograph could be AI generated. And a lot of it probably WILL be, because you will get malicious people who poison the well by generating faked evidence eg. ysing AI voice generators to create Churchill/Hitler speeches that never actually happened, but sound 100% real and identical to their real voice. So even gaining basic knowledge of the biggest historical events of the modern world suddenly becomes an impossible task because there's too much risk of coming across fake information.

          But it goes even deeper than that. Imagine you have a family photo album and you want to pass it down the generations so your grandchildren can see what their ancestors looked like. Well now, that album is totally useless because all of the photos could just be fake. They could all be AI. Basically as soon as a human being dies, their entire existence becomes suspect, you cannot in any way verify that somebody actually existed or not because every piece of visual evidence of their life is now worthless.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            You're not reading what's being said to you. It all boils down to trusting the source. morons like you are going to believe whatever "feels right" regardless; there's basically no point in trying to get you to give up your dystopian schizo fantasy.

            • 9 months ago
              Anonymous

              >It all boils down to trusting the source.
              But you will not be able to truly trust ANY source anymore.

              Even if the source is trustworthy, there is still the possibility that they got tricked by an AI-generated fake and then supplied it to you, thinking it was real.

              Go to an old school library and pick up a book that was printed and published prior to 2010 if you want to study history.

              How do you know for sure that a book was produced before 2010? People could produce fake history books full of AI-generated fake images, made to look as if it is a real and reputable book.

              • 9 months ago
                Anonymous

                >How do you know for sure that a book was produced before 2010?
                Aged paper. Ink technology.

              • 9 months ago
                Anonymous

                >But you will not be able to truly trust ANY source anymore.
                No, my friend. YOU will not be able to trust any source anymore. Don't project your schizo fantasies onto me.

              • 9 months ago
                Anonymous

                >takes everything at face value
                >calls people exercising critical-thinking faculties schizo
                I hate to break it to you anon...

              • 9 months ago
                Anonymous

                >misses the point

              • 9 months ago
                Anonymous

                Correct. You will have to rely on real human interaction with people you know and trust because you've been in communication with them and share common values and goals or have common reasons not to lie or frick each other over. The value of the truth of history is vastly over stated on an individual level. Science, as it exists in the universities today, has almost nothing to do with proof and everything to do with chasing grant money and pleasing the editorial boards of large journals.

                There's value, but very little of it derives from the structure we have around us. Sadly, we are creatures who cannot comprehend outside of our very limited frame of existence. If Twitter is popular now, thus has it always been. Brexit scared a nation with over hundreds and hundreds of years of existence into thinking it couldn't possibly go on as though people simply cannot farm or trade with the structure they happen to currently know.

                It's a farce and an illusion and it has made everyone thoughtless and scared.

              • 9 months ago
                Anonymous

                >Correct. You will have to rely on real human interaction with people you know and trust because you've been in communication with them and share common values and goals or have common reasons not to lie or frick each other over.

                And this is good, because...? I learned to code and became a software engineer to avoid interactions with normies.

              • 9 months ago
                Anonymous

                And yet the industry is overrun with smiling, personal communication loving micromanager normies who want you to go to standups and take part in company retreats. And normies are flooding the tech world every day for a shot at the cash. Enjoy watching some brain dead party girl who barely got her degree tell you you're not meeting your KPIs and, frankly, you could be a bit more personable at the morning meeting. You like, never say hi to anyone or anything, anon. I'm noting it on your performance review, okay? It's just a little thing you can maybe work on.

            • 9 months ago
              Anonymous

              well put

              >It all boils down to trusting the source.
              But you will not be able to truly trust ANY source anymore.

              Even if the source is trustworthy, there is still the possibility that they got tricked by an AI-generated fake and then supplied it to you, thinking it was real.

              [...]
              How do you know for sure that a book was produced before 2010? People could produce fake history books full of AI-generated fake images, made to look as if it is a real and reputable book.

              >But you will not be able to truly trust ANY source anymore.
              source: my ass

              making this ai shit work is way harder and costly than you're making it out to be.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            Go to an old school library and pick up a book that was printed and published prior to 2010 if you want to study history.

          • 9 months ago
            Anonymous

            It's depressing, but kind of fascinating because AI was never really imagined to be used in this way. AI in fiction is normally shackled to the truth for better or worse. I mean in theory ChatGPT should only be capable of telling truthful accounts of things rather than imagining a fictional event.
            I suppose AI Art gets a bit more hard to contain in this regard because art deals inherently with the hypothetical.

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        this is already where anyone who pays attention to the various AI models threads is at unfortunately. nation states can and do produce supremely convincing fakes today and before long (<12m) any idiot with a web browser will be able to create undetectable hoaxes of anything they want.

        If you didn't see it with your own eyes it is fake and gay unless proven otherwise. Anything consumed via a screen is entertainment and nothing more. It's like using /misc/ for anything other than shitposts. Only with real life.

        AI is also why Google has gone to shit. The search space is now an adversarial generative network with chatbots competing with whatever PageRank is these days. Actual humans trying to grep the internet for a string have no chance.

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        >wild
        >subreddit
        >troony
        BINGO

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        it's basically 1984

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        and thats a good thing because if we can make WW2 seem gay then thats when we win because nobody will trust the liars in the media anymore

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        >completely missing the irony of a troony talking about fake happenings
        I hope "she" is on /r/selfawarewolves

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        >a world where the Holocaust can finally be said to be fake and people will finally believe it

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        We already live in this world. Don’t tell me you thought bin ladens death photo was real lmao

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        Reject the digital
        Return to physical

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          time to reject the virtual dicking and back to the real deal

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      In this clown world, does it even matter if we can distinguish between reality and falsehood?

      Yes, go back to having news spread by word of mouth.

  3. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    who cares if something actually happened or not

  4. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Look at the hands

  5. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    they are going to require digital watermarks on all AI generated content and try to lock training and whatnot behind licenses and regulation, with their hopes that these "near-perfect" models will have traceability. If their efforts are successful (I'm not convinced of this given the current state of imagegen particularly) then the excuse of "this image of me murdering this guy is totally fake and ai generated" won't be acceptable in court unless it has the digital watermark. In such a world, it would only require access to good models and generative systems that don't have these watermarks to effectively frame anyone of any crime. I don't know if they'll be successful in watermarking AI-generated content, but they might be more successful in pushing such watermarks for actual photos and videos. I still wonder how airtight and cryptographically secure the implementations of this will be, or how standardized

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      >they are going to require digital watermarks on all AI generated content
      except people already own the means of producing them without the internet now and that's going to be about as plausible as repealing the 2nd Amendment
      >but this will happen because it makes sense in my mind
      frick you

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        Easy. They're going to require digital watermarks on all generated content.
        >but that's insane
        Microsoft is already partnering with a digital camera company to have the watermark builtin.

        • 9 months ago
          Anonymous

          Sam Altman also has a digital ID corp he's shilling.

  6. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    >How do we distinguish between reality and falsehood in an AI world?
    Hey goy, you better be able to distinguish between reality and falsehood or else!
    Also: let's gaslight the goy so he no longer knows what's reality or a falsehood.

  7. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    AI generated content is "invisibly" watermarked in frequency space, so if you know pretty basic math like Fourier transforms you can tell what's real and what's not

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      is that on purpose or a consequence of the process?

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        SD essentially works like you have a static TV screen that is gradually formed into the desired prompt. The static-y artifacts will still be present.

        It's not much effort to just implement outlining the image and removing it though.

  8. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    That is our intent, anon. We are destroying the poison by flooding the system. Soon, you will have to see it to believe it. It's the only way forward for mankind. The infinite support group of the internet has been a cancer on humankind. This is the chemo.

  9. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    You don't.
    I've been talking about this for ages.

    It's gonna create a some weird society where we will be physical again, a renaissance of the physical world, you will have to see something to believe it like before television

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      And worst case scenario: Due to laws and regulations only the government has access to this technology, and it will be hell

  10. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    >reality
    it's all bullshit. has been for a reeeal long time.

  11. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    You don't. Media isn't real anymore, if it ever was.

  12. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    In what world do you think people actually care about true or false, right or wrong? When people use these terms, they are really saying:

    "Whatever helps me is the truth, whatever gets me what I like is wrong; Whatever I don't like is false, and whatever hinders me is wrong."

    Moral judgments are based on whether something is seen as a hindrance or obstacle by the individual who is making a judgment.
    Our media already obscures facts or outright lies about them, yet people continue to believe what is said because they choose to. AI will be no different, because individuals only ever cared about their own truths. Besides, the truth doesn't matter, only what can be believed.

  13. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    KYC for all internet access. Soon to your nearest utopia

  14. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Dude, we used to live in caves and hunt mammoths with spears. I'm sure we'll adapt to a fricking photo generation algorithm just fine.

  15. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    we can't. and imagine if this is what the general public has access to, imagine what the glow agencies AIs can do.

  16. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Before photos, people would communicate events via text. They could be completely falsified as well. Welcome to history.

  17. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    How do I know that what was written on this tablet wasn't a lie, and Ahmed didn't actually give Mehmet the 10 bushels?

  18. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    There's going to be a point where there is a mandate for lawyers and judges to be certified in identifying AI/machine generated content and proving that evidence is not AI/machine generated becomes a prerequisite for submission all around (tbh this is unlikely),
    OR
    the masses are going to be expected to be able to provide alibis proving innocence whenever they are charged such as cellphone location history or timestamped camera footage showcasing them in a different location at the time of the crime, with the defense then ironically having to prove that their evidence is real and not machine generated while the prosection has no such obligation (unfortunately more likely since that kind of obligation would actively protect innocents from being railroiladed).

    • 9 months ago
      Loxism

      kys israelite

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        Hey man I'm just saying what I guess will happen based on how our world works, not that I agree with it.
        Anticipating bad things gives you a chance to mitigate. Pretending everyone who suggests bad things are possible is a bad guy that needs to be silenced is how the bad things actually happen.

      • 9 months ago
        Anonymous

        obsessed

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      You do realize its "innocent untill proven guilty" right, its the other guy that needs to prove first the witness is lying and then present its AI generated or smth

  19. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    The avionics in the f35 were developed 30 years ago.
    Now think about your question some more.

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      I can't believe Lockheed is successfully milking tech they stole from the fall of the Soviet Union for so long.

  20. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Trusted hardware with public/private key signing - for individuals.
    For the internet in general, yeah it'll be a shit show but as others have said not much different than current "fake news" situation.

  21. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    colonel sanders goes hard

  22. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    All this means is that physical works will become king again.

  23. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    That fretboard is wrong.

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      He plays a junior model. Don't judge him.

  24. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    It's not about the content you fool, it's about the context.

  25. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Time to welcome the Dark Age Overlords. Not just lack of written material of what has occurred in our time, but also the noise of misinformation and disinformation.
    Try out writing a journal. Your works might survive and you'll be famous 1000 years later. (Famous for being an idiot)

  26. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    >Turn off computer
    >Turn off phone
    >Turn off tv
    Suddenly AI has no more power over you.

    • 9 months ago
      Anonymous

      you have to also convince the people that you interact with to do the same

  27. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Usually you just look at them and you can tell if they are real or not.

  28. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    You're not gonna like the answer, which is that we'll be living in a panopticon before long (perhaps even one ushered in by problems like this one), and the way people will know whether you really fricked a sheep last week is because they'll have a comprehensive library of real-time visual and biometric data from every second of your life that will confirm or refute it.

  29. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    BOT is not going to like this but creating a hash of something like the internet archive at this moment and storing it on the ethereum blockchain is a good way to prove to future people that all this data existed in 2022 and is therefore not AI generated

  30. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    I have a different question. What even do after corpo replaces everyone with AI?
    Sit at home fapping in the metabaterverse with your goyvision pro?

  31. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    It happened with the Gulf War, happened in 2020 with the flu, is happening now...
    AI is only going to disrupt the reality the same way traditional media does, but efficiency will increase.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Gulf_War_Did_Not_Take_Place

  32. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    its very simple anon
    we go back to the way it used to be, a long time ago:
    dont trust shit on the internet
    maybe it wont happen immediately, but it'll happen over time. it'll be glorious

  33. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Everything can already be faked, it's just quicker with AI.

    Nothing will change.

  34. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    That image doesn't look real, it looks like an illustration. The lighting is too good for a concert. Surfaces are too shiny. The proportions are off, the head is too big compared to the guitar.
    Real life pictures look more mundane.

  35. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    Datasets will presumably be fricked up in a characteristic way so that the output is recognizably false, either because it fricks up the AI output or because the AI can't replicate some kind of authenticity marker.
    >people can no longer tell what is real and what is fake
    This is already being done via marketing, people don't question marketing enough for realistic AI generated content to make a difference.

  36. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    the same way that you distinguish a real picture and a photoshopped picture?

  37. 9 months ago
    Anonymous
  38. 9 months ago
    Anonymous

    heads and it's AI

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