Watching Linux go from a hotbed of innovation and freedom to an incestuous nest of vipers stifling progress has been one of the most depressing things I've ever experienced. Linux flat out will not be able to compete with any other OS if it bans AI pull requests.
>noooo you have to let incompetent fricks use muh copilot!!!
AI generates shit code. Maybe if we ever achieve AGI, but right now it's useless to anyone who knows what they're doing, and dangerous for IP and copyright reasons. I'm just waiting for the case where an AI spits out something patented and a court rules that the LLM owners must purge the model of all material under patent or copyright. It's coming.
Linux also did not "follow innovation" by adding telemetry, trying to offload workloads onto cloud services, or requiring signup to online accounts
Linux is pretty fricking conservative in practice, and that’s why it’s good
>hotbed of innovation and freedom
What the frick are you talking about. Linux has been kneecapped for fricking decades by salty gcc Black folk breaking compat because they're mad they're poor
I wasn't really going to participate in this thread, but I had a thought. GNU+Gentoo/Funtoo are incredibly fun. They also haven't ever let me down or disappointed me in any way. I think this is the right call; even if ``it leads to the death of Gentoo'' because of how the market unfolds in the future, I am happy ``made by real people'' was put forth as a reason to draw the line.
it's very funny until it actually happens. I don't think we've ever been in a situation where there was no palatable version of Windows being maintained. there was always a 98 to the ME, an XP to the Vista, a 7 to the 8. and if Microsoft cuts the support to 10 without releasing a functional 12 we reach unprecedented territory. and considering that Microsoft is too busy sucking AI dick to improve any of their software, I think we're likely to enter that territory
My windows won't even let me leave windows and clone my drives properly.
Possibly something to do with defender or ntfs fricking up my boot records because it also fricked up my VMs of linux.
Either that or VMware is malware.
Or hyper-V is broken.
>gentoo-dev: "Ban all AI contributions." >OP: "Gentoo bans all AI contributions." >You: "NOOOOOOOOOOOOO WHY IS OP LYING *pig squeal* EEAAAAAAAAAARGH *shits pants* MOM MY BLOOD PRESSURE PILLS QUICK IT'S HAPPENING AGAIN!!!"
Cope. Gentoo just became even more based if that was possible.
then don't worry about it? a lot of time you can tell because your PR will have irrelevant stuff or pointless refactors, or you can't actually explain the PR. if that's not the case then it doesn't matter and you basically just used the LLM as a search engine but you understood what you were doing properly.
he'll never know if a pull request is AI assisted or not....
Please delve in to the following commit. The bug fixes send shivers down my spine as I assist you in determining the root cause. By fixing bugs, our bonds will grow.
Gay and cringe, good code is good code. I don't care where it comes from, AI definitely isn't there yet where it produces much good code, but I think you can use AI as a assistant and come out with a good final product just not 100% AI yet if ever
The problem is Jeets pressing generate and submitting them undecillion times over to try if it would be good code now. Purely relying on human experts to review your random generated garbage for you for free is unsustainable.
Watching Linux go from a hotbed of innovation and freedom to an incestuous nest of vipers stifling progress has been one of the most depressing things I've ever experienced. Linux flat out will not be able to compete with any other OS if it bans AI pull requests.
Makes sense. It would be a shame if AI was used to drive a code base out into no man's land only for the person who took them there to disappear or have their productivity cut out at the legs by OpenAI and others in that market jacking up prices... almost nobody is actually self-hosting this shit. The only people self-hosting in large numbers are the coomers.
the last point doesnt really make sense. Chip, motherboard, and gpu manufacturers dont care about 'people' either, yet Gentoo still supports modules supporting thier hardware. GPUs especially take up a ton of power regardless of what they do (gaming, crypto, LLMs). Does Gentoo also ban code contributions that fulfill a bug bounty paid in crypto for exmaple?
The first 2 points are the only real ones, and the first more than the second.
Quality concerns are completely valid, but "muh copyright" and muh ""ethics"" just screams virtue signaling with a long nose.
>it is empowering scam and enshittification
Black personlicious argument, yes, let's ban any technology that can be misused and used in immoral scenarios
Linux also did not "follow innovation" by adding telemetry, trying to offload workloads onto cloud services, or requiring signup to online accounts
Linux is pretty fricking conservative in practice, and that’s why it’s good
This is not about forcing AI on the users but prohibiting contributor use of AI, and thereby also stopping Gentoo from using AI assisted tooling in its own automated workflows.
Of course they should not depend on SAAS but running AI on their end should be fine. The reasoning put forward makes no sense.
It's about not letting morons submit garbage, that's perfectly sensible reason, you imbecile. If you're smart enough to make sure that the result is correct, you're smart enough to make sure people won't recognize that you used AI assistance in the first place.
This. How the frick are they gonna know it was created with the use of AI? By its low quality, this isn't a ban on AI, it's a ban on garbage contributions, it's a minimum quality threshold.
>nooo! you have to let the AI generated sloppa through! it's not the submitter's job to verify the sloppa works, it's innovation! you're stifling innovation, you have to let the slopa through!
Linux is not for nocoders. get fricked
Banning code assistants is weird. Banning low-quality code by them yes, but if you submit pajeet tier garbage right now you'll be chewed out and your code rejected, why would submitting AI-assisted garbage require a special case compared to that? >but if you do it well enough they won't even be able to tell!
Yes sure, but you'll still be breaking the rules, and it basically means you have to keep it a secret. Yeah if you're a one-off contributor who submits and maintains like two niche ebuilds, nobody will care, but if you're actually involved in the project, you'll have to constantly be in hiding about your workflow. And then if you get found out, even though up to that point all your contributions had been of a good quality and nobody suspected a thing, suddenly you'll be in violation of the rules.
Banning AI from messages, bug reports or the like probably makes sense, LLMs are still currently really shit at writing natural language that doesn't sound extremely robotic. Maybe in a few years they won't be, though.
The last two sentences are already wrong! And Gentoo doesn't even have rules against people with imperfect literacy in English submitting reports.
Of course no one complains if automated trash spam is banned/muted and hidden, but that did not need the cause and justification of it being covered under some anti AI clauses, it was already possible.
The problem is bug reports are supposed to be about a problem someone is having. Forum posts are supposed to be about people discussing and exchanging information. Having AIs participate lowers the value of discussion.
Posts have no value in and of themselves, only inasmuch as the humans writing them derivce from the communication.
Code is different because code is not a means to a human end, it's meant to be executed by a computer and work. If an AI can write perfect code, there's nothing wrong with it being "not human". In fact code generators have been in use since forever, for things that were generatable; AI just lets this approach expand to even less boilerplatey-code.
>Code is different because code is not a means to a human end
Code was literally invented for humans to read it, it's machine code that is executed by the computer. >In fact code generators
And they always were bloated garbage.
>Banning low-quality code by them yes, but if you submit pajeet tier garbage right now you'll be chewed out and your code rejected, why would submitting AI-assisted garbage require a special case compared to that?
It's about not getting overwhelmed by the sheer quantity of it, anon. AI makes it easier to submit large amounts of gibberish.
But again, why would that not be covered by the current rules, where presumably if you repeatedly submit low-quality garbage additional measures will be taken to remove you?
If you literally just let an AI spam auto-generated contributions with minimal oversight, it will quickly become obvious.
Like, I can understand the issue with say art websites, because AI art can sometimes look decent but you can generate 1000 variations on the same theme of which anywhere between 50 and 200 or so will look actually great, but all will look passable. But even spamming 50 identical images has no value. But again, that's for artistic endavours. For code, if you use AI to try to generate 1000 commits, and of those 50 are actual quality code, there's no reason not to accept those 50; except that you have to vet those yourself, and if you try to submit the 950 other ones too you'll just be instabanned from the project probably before you can get past 20 or so.
Its not about effective enforcement of the policy, the point is to take an ideological stance.
Local models are pretty comfy right now, and I hope they continue to improve, but the cloud corporate models are so incredibly evil that collectively there should be a stand against that shit.
Quality concerns are completely valid, but "muh copyright" and muh ""ethics"" just screams virtue signaling with a long nose.
>it is empowering scam and enshittification
Black personlicious argument, yes, let's ban any technology that can be misused and used in immoral scenarios
We should absolutely be banning corporations from selling AI, its not about progress because if it was, the top tier shit would be open. As of now they open their sloppy seconds and the local model people do what they can to make it not shit but it's never going to be on par with any gayMAN model, and that's by design.
Naturally, people wanting a useful AI assistant will end up at some point using a cloud model after frustratingly running into the limits of the local ones.
> *go to chatgpt* > "Write an ebuild for this" > *send the result to gentooo* > "Here an ebuild that I wrote" > *merged*
people will just omit it was AI duh
kek, thanks to this REEEing learned about pkgx, awesome stuff just managed to install node 20 and go compiler on my sfos phone with it, pretty cool even though it feels like creating a frankenstein, but test go project compiled just fine, great stuff)
Racist
just
use
artix
>just
>use
>*farts*
>artix
>fartix
oops, I made a typo, I meant antix
they couldn't ban contributions from Indians directly
Watching Linux go from a hotbed of innovation and freedom to an incestuous nest of vipers stifling progress has been one of the most depressing things I've ever experienced. Linux flat out will not be able to compete with any other OS if it bans AI pull requests.
Have fun with your AI zero days on wintrash
Absolutely based.
>noooo you have to let incompetent fricks use muh copilot!!!
AI generates shit code. Maybe if we ever achieve AGI, but right now it's useless to anyone who knows what they're doing, and dangerous for IP and copyright reasons. I'm just waiting for the case where an AI spits out something patented and a court rules that the LLM owners must purge the model of all material under patent or copyright. It's coming.
Get fricked redditor
Well this is what happens when you use corporate funding from Google and Windows to build your shit. They frick it up over time.
Why not just have ChatGPT make a distro for you?
>t. Rakesh Kumar Baldeep
Linux also did not "follow innovation" by adding telemetry, trying to offload workloads onto cloud services, or requiring signup to online accounts
Linux is pretty fricking conservative in practice, and that’s why it’s good
>hotbed of innovation and freedom
What the frick are you talking about. Linux has been kneecapped for fricking decades by salty gcc Black folk breaking compat because they're mad they're poor
I wasn't really going to participate in this thread, but I had a thought. GNU+Gentoo/Funtoo are incredibly fun. They also haven't ever let me down or disappointed me in any way. I think this is the right call; even if ``it leads to the death of Gentoo'' because of how the market unfolds in the future, I am happy ``made by real people'' was put forth as a reason to draw the line.
I'm so glad I never wasted a second with gentoo, arch can't stop winning.
holy fricking based I thought gentoo was just a meme
I might actually install gentoo.
This. It's what I will use once windows 12 becomes mandatory or something.
>this time i'll totally leave windows
Lmao
Hey I already dual boot with Linux. So I am not the average person y'know
it's very funny until it actually happens. I don't think we've ever been in a situation where there was no palatable version of Windows being maintained. there was always a 98 to the ME, an XP to the Vista, a 7 to the 8. and if Microsoft cuts the support to 10 without releasing a functional 12 we reach unprecedented territory. and considering that Microsoft is too busy sucking AI dick to improve any of their software, I think we're likely to enter that territory
some of us do leave windows
believe it or not, i don't dualboot
My windows won't even let me leave windows and clone my drives properly.
Possibly something to do with defender or ntfs fricking up my boot records because it also fricked up my VMs of linux.
Either that or VMware is malware.
Or hyper-V is broken.
This is good. Remove casuals. I thought that was half the appeal of using alternative operating systems?
imagine if AI actually worked. contract-based programming would be so cool
>guy writes an email
>desperate attention prostitute OP writes a lying clickbait thread to generate attention for himself
this. I know people don't read sources. But not even taking a look at the image is on another level. BOT is truly moronic for falling for this.
They approved the policy on the 14th.
>implying
Then use that as the OP image instead of some homosexual's email you dumb clickbaiting c**t.
>gentoo-dev: "Ban all AI contributions."
>OP: "Gentoo bans all AI contributions."
>You: "NOOOOOOOOOOOOO WHY IS OP LYING *pig squeal* EEAAAAAAAAAARGH *shits pants* MOM MY BLOOD PRESSURE PILLS QUICK IT'S HAPPENING AGAIN!!!"
Cope. Gentoo just became even more based if that was possible.
Yes. What's your point? You even point out the lie in your post, right before strawmanning the act of pointing out the lie for some reason
>You even point out the lie in your post
I liked gentoo before and now I like it more
sinking ship, abandon
I'm pro-AI but seems reasonable? I don't think anyone sane thinks LLMs are at the point yet where we can trust them to write our operating systems.
aitroon zoomers seething. stick to troon distros
he'll never know if a pull request is AI assisted or not....
that's the funny thing, if ai was really so good you wouldn't be able to tell but you usually can. that's why all the ai people are seething.
nah, you can't tell if it's AI assisted, only if it's written full by it.
then don't worry about it? a lot of time you can tell because your PR will have irrelevant stuff or pointless refactors, or you can't actually explain the PR. if that's not the case then it doesn't matter and you basically just used the LLM as a search engine but you understood what you were doing properly.
I don't contribute to open source projects and I don't pay for AI assist. You should worry because you won't be able to moderate this stuff.
how will he know
Please delve in to the following commit. The bug fixes send shivers down my spine as I assist you in determining the root cause. By fixing bugs, our bonds will grow.
Gay and cringe, good code is good code. I don't care where it comes from, AI definitely isn't there yet where it produces much good code, but I think you can use AI as a assistant and come out with a good final product just not 100% AI yet if ever
The problem is Jeets pressing generate and submitting them undecillion times over to try if it would be good code now. Purely relying on human experts to review your random generated garbage for you for free is unsustainable.
This.
Makes sense. It would be a shame if AI was used to drive a code base out into no man's land only for the person who took them there to disappear or have their productivity cut out at the legs by OpenAI and others in that market jacking up prices... almost nobody is actually self-hosting this shit. The only people self-hosting in large numbers are the coomers.
>gentoo psyop
ugh okay i guess i will compile Linux to see what devices it supports ok, ok thank you and bye.
>Copyright concerns
Bullshit some suit made up.
>Quality concern
Humans don't code like shit? You don't review your shit? Are you moronic? (Yes)
>Ethical concerns
Bullshit some philosophy major made up.
This guy is fricking buffoon.
>AI will just be a scapegoat to enforce DRM restrictions and force people to never use correct code
Knew it.
Can we burn our governments now? They're literally killing people with enforcing this shit.
Holy based.
AI troons coping and seething hard ITT.
Finally, someone posts Alpha Centauri that isn't me.
Still the best game ever made.
CIV:BE was a joke.
oh no gentoo sirs how will we do the needfuls now?
the last point doesnt really make sense. Chip, motherboard, and gpu manufacturers dont care about 'people' either, yet Gentoo still supports modules supporting thier hardware. GPUs especially take up a ton of power regardless of what they do (gaming, crypto, LLMs). Does Gentoo also ban code contributions that fulfill a bug bounty paid in crypto for exmaple?
The first 2 points are the only real ones, and the first more than the second.
you just know that guy is a troony chaser from that post
Quality concerns are completely valid, but "muh copyright" and muh ""ethics"" just screams virtue signaling with a long nose.
>it is empowering scam and enshittification
Black personlicious argument, yes, let's ban any technology that can be misused and used in immoral scenarios
>but "muh copyright" and muh ""ethics"" just screams virtue signaling with a long nose.
cope
>Black personlicious argument
very valid argument, ramashit downdathroata.
>the creeping butthurt of AI-tards as they realise it was all a terrible meme
>The AI bubble is causing huge energy waste.
>huge energy waste
>HUGE ENERGY WASTE
>[ COMPILING INTENSIFIES ]
Yea, exactly.
This is not about forcing AI on the users but prohibiting contributor use of AI, and thereby also stopping Gentoo from using AI assisted tooling in its own automated workflows.
Of course they should not depend on SAAS but running AI on their end should be fine. The reasoning put forward makes no sense.
It's about not letting morons submit garbage, that's perfectly sensible reason, you imbecile. If you're smart enough to make sure that the result is correct, you're smart enough to make sure people won't recognize that you used AI assistance in the first place.
This. How the frick are they gonna know it was created with the use of AI? By its low quality, this isn't a ban on AI, it's a ban on garbage contributions, it's a minimum quality threshold.
>BOT pretends chatbots can produce working code and accurate documentation because other bots copy and paste le based cartoon child porn for them
>nooo! you have to let the AI generated sloppa through! it's not the submitter's job to verify the sloppa works, it's innovation! you're stifling innovation, you have to let the slopa through!
Linux is not for nocoders. get fricked
Banning code assistants is weird. Banning low-quality code by them yes, but if you submit pajeet tier garbage right now you'll be chewed out and your code rejected, why would submitting AI-assisted garbage require a special case compared to that?
>but if you do it well enough they won't even be able to tell!
Yes sure, but you'll still be breaking the rules, and it basically means you have to keep it a secret. Yeah if you're a one-off contributor who submits and maintains like two niche ebuilds, nobody will care, but if you're actually involved in the project, you'll have to constantly be in hiding about your workflow. And then if you get found out, even though up to that point all your contributions had been of a good quality and nobody suspected a thing, suddenly you'll be in violation of the rules.
Banning AI from messages, bug reports or the like probably makes sense, LLMs are still currently really shit at writing natural language that doesn't sound extremely robotic. Maybe in a few years they won't be, though.
The last two sentences are already wrong! And Gentoo doesn't even have rules against people with imperfect literacy in English submitting reports.
Of course no one complains if automated trash spam is banned/muted and hidden, but that did not need the cause and justification of it being covered under some anti AI clauses, it was already possible.
The problem is bug reports are supposed to be about a problem someone is having. Forum posts are supposed to be about people discussing and exchanging information. Having AIs participate lowers the value of discussion.
Posts have no value in and of themselves, only inasmuch as the humans writing them derivce from the communication.
Code is different because code is not a means to a human end, it's meant to be executed by a computer and work. If an AI can write perfect code, there's nothing wrong with it being "not human". In fact code generators have been in use since forever, for things that were generatable; AI just lets this approach expand to even less boilerplatey-code.
>Code is different because code is not a means to a human end
Code was literally invented for humans to read it, it's machine code that is executed by the computer.
>In fact code generators
And they always were bloated garbage.
>Banning low-quality code by them yes, but if you submit pajeet tier garbage right now you'll be chewed out and your code rejected, why would submitting AI-assisted garbage require a special case compared to that?
It's about not getting overwhelmed by the sheer quantity of it, anon. AI makes it easier to submit large amounts of gibberish.
But again, why would that not be covered by the current rules, where presumably if you repeatedly submit low-quality garbage additional measures will be taken to remove you?
If you literally just let an AI spam auto-generated contributions with minimal oversight, it will quickly become obvious.
Like, I can understand the issue with say art websites, because AI art can sometimes look decent but you can generate 1000 variations on the same theme of which anywhere between 50 and 200 or so will look actually great, but all will look passable. But even spamming 50 identical images has no value. But again, that's for artistic endavours. For code, if you use AI to try to generate 1000 commits, and of those 50 are actual quality code, there's no reason not to accept those 50; except that you have to vet those yourself, and if you try to submit the 950 other ones too you'll just be instabanned from the project probably before you can get past 20 or so.
I don't see the issue.
Its not about effective enforcement of the policy, the point is to take an ideological stance.
Local models are pretty comfy right now, and I hope they continue to improve, but the cloud corporate models are so incredibly evil that collectively there should be a stand against that shit.
We should absolutely be banning corporations from selling AI, its not about progress because if it was, the top tier shit would be open. As of now they open their sloppy seconds and the local model people do what they can to make it not shit but it's never going to be on par with any gayMAN model, and that's by design.
Naturally, people wanting a useful AI assistant will end up at some point using a cloud model after frustratingly running into the limits of the local ones.
he writes like a commie
Super based Michal, gentoo is truly the best distro.
> *go to chatgpt*
> "Write an ebuild for this"
> *send the result to gentooo*
> "Here an ebuild that I wrote"
> *merged*
people will just omit it was AI duh
kek, thanks to this REEEing learned about pkgx, awesome stuff just managed to install node 20 and go compiler on my sfos phone with it, pretty cool even though it feels like creating a frankenstein, but test go project compiled just fine, great stuff)